June 26th, 2014

CNN EXCLUSIVE: Conrad Murray: “I’m remorseful”

Five years after the death of Michael Jackson, CNN’s Don Lemon spoke exclusively to Michael Jackson’s former physician Conrad Murray. Murray spoke about his conviction, his relationship with Jackson and his children, his medical care of Jackson and more.


Conrad Murray: “I’m remorseful”

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Murray on dynamics of Jackson’s family






It’s hard to believe that it was five years ago that Michael Jackson died.  His doctor, Conrad Murray, found guilty of involuntary manslaughter, spending two years behind bars, but that is not the end of the story.


Tonight, you’re going to hear from Dr. Conrad Murray.  There he is, live right here.  It is his first and only American interview since his release from prison, and he says he wants to set the record straight once and for all.


Plus, talk about ripped from the headlines, the Army investigating freed POW Sergeant Bowe Bergdahl.  Special forces operatives lure the Benghazi suspect into a trap.  It’s almost as if Hollywood wrote it.  So who better to talk to than the man behind “Homeland,” Howard Gordon?


And it could be the biggest World Cup game yet, team USA vs. Germany tomorrow.  We’re going preview it for you.


And, as always, we want to know what you think about all of this.  Make sure you tweet us using #AskDon.


But, first, I want to give you my take on Dr. Conrad Murray as he sits here right in front of me live this evening.


Doctor, many people were wondering why we should even give you a platform on the anniversary of Michael Jackson’s death, like Jo, who wrote on Twitter: “Why has Michael’s killer given airtime?”


That’s what she said.  “Show some respect on our legend’s anniversary.”


I believe, if we played by those rules, we would never do an interview.  And I believe in transparency and having as much information as possible.  Dr. Murray agreed to do this interview knowing that no question is off limits, and he has promised to answer each of them candidly and honestly.






LEMON:  Right.  Let’s move on now.


Before we get started, I want to go back to the trial that sent you, Dr. Murray, to prison for your role in Michael Jackson’s death.


Here is CNN’s Sara Sidner.




UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE:  We the jury in the above entitled action find the defendant, Conrad Robert Murray, guilty.


SARA SIDNER, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over):  Dr. Conrad Murray spent two years in prison, convicted of involuntary manslaughter for providing the king of pop an overdose of the powerful anesthetic Propofol.  It was supposed to help Michael Jackson sleep.  Instead, it killed him.  His family and fans were devastated.


Back in 2009, as Michael Jackson rehearsed for his upcoming This Is It world tour, he struggled with his pain and trouble sleeping.  Dr. Murray was his personal physician.  A month-and-a-half before Jackson died in his bedroom, the star’s voice was recorded on Murray’s cell phone.  It was entered into court evidence.


MICHAEL JACKSON, ENTERTAINER:  I want them to say he’s the greatest entertainer in the world.


SIDNER:  Prosecutors made the case that the drug-induced slurred speech was a clear sign that Jackson was out of control, and Dr. Murray should have known that he needed to be weaned off Propofol.


Instead, prosecutors say the doctor ordered more.  But Murray has maintained he was trying to wean the star off the drug, and it was Jackson who self-administered the fatal dose.  But a jury blamed Dr. Murray for Jackson’s death, saying he was responsible.


Dr. Murray went to prison, his medical license revoted in Texas and suspended in California and Nevada.  Eight months ago, his time served, he walked out of prison.


MURRAY:  This is part of the untold story.


SIDNER:  Murray is vowing to get his medical license back.  He has even published his own video to reassert his claim that he was wrongfully convicted.  His attorney says he may appeal his case all the way to the Supreme Court.


VALERIE WASS, ATTORNEY FOR MURRAY:  He has been adamant about his innocence.  And after spending two years on the case, I truly believe in him.  And I believe he was wrongfully convicted also.


SIDNER:  Sara Sidner, CNN, Los Angeles.




LEMON:  So, joining me now exclusively to tell his side of the story is Dr. Conrad Murray.


When I said what the person said in that tweet, murderer, you flinched.  Why?


MURRAY:  Well, I’m not.


LEMON:  Killer?




LEMON:  Not.  Not.  So that bothers you.


Before we get to the video, right, that talks about — Dr. Conrad Murray talks, it’s 7:00 p.m. on the West Coast, 10:00 on the East Coast.  Five years ago, what were you doing at this very moment?


MURRAY:  Oh, my gosh.


At this time, it was just monumental grief, an unexpected, surreal situation.  I cannot believe the changes that happened within a couple of hours.  It was just impossible.  It was just unfathomable.


I could not believe that, just hours ago, I was trying to muster all the strength I can to save the life of a friend and a patient, and here I am, on to the spotlight, all focus, fingers pointing as though I’m the one to blame.


LEMON:  Were you still at the hospital?  Because I know you went to the ambulance with him.  Right?


MURRAY:  I stayed in the hospital until near 6:00, maybe after 5:30.  I was…




LEMON:  Pacific time?




LEMON:  Right.  So at this time, were you back at his mansion?  Where were you?


MURRAY:  At this time, I would probably be at home.  I got home to the apartment.


LEMON:  Yes.


Let’s — I want to — what do you remember about that day?  Because I have done several documentaries, and I start them by saying, on the morning, he did everything that he — you know, preparing for a show, that he loved, preparing for a show.  What do you remember about that day?


MURRAY:  Well, you know, what time of day?  You talk about the time he came home, which is the night before, around 1:00, just shortly after 1:00.  And he just was not able to sleep.




Here is the timeline, just to refresh your memory.  So, 1:00 a.m., Murray summoned to Jackson’s home, right, 1:30 a.m., 10 milligram tablet of Valium, 2:00 a.m., two milligrams of lorazepam.


Lorazepam injected into him; 3:00 a.m., two milligrams of midazolam, right?  And then, 5:00 a.m., more lorazepam, two milligrams.  And then again, 7:30, two milligrams again of midazolam, and then Propofol diluted, 25 milligrams.


MURRAY:  So you can just summarize.  Let’s make it simple.


There were four milligrams of lorazepam given to him during that — all of the time you spoke about and four milligrams of midazolam.  They were just in divided doses.


LEMON:  So,why — were you ever worried about administering so many drugs to Michael Jackson?  Did you ever think like, you know, this person could die, but I’m giving him so many drugs?


MURRAY:  But, certainly, I do not think Michael Jackson would die from four milligrams of lorazepam or four milligrams of midazolam.


We do that all the time in the hospital.  But, certainly, I was divided and I was very cautious as far as giving Michael Jackson that type of medication to sleep.  As you know, before that time, Michael Jackson was on Propofol.  And I had warned him successfully off of Propofol up to three days prior to his death.  He never received Propofol.


LEMON:  But not successfully then, if you had — you said you had weaned him off.




LEMON:  But then why did he go back on?


MURRAY:  He did not go back on.


Before that, I would treat Michael Jackson with an infusion.  It was continuous.  But the day he died, I did tell the police that I relented after all of the pressure and all of the changes that Michael was going through.  Unbeknownst to me, it was because he was in withdrawal of another substance.


LEMON:  Which was?


MURRAY:  Demerol.


LEMON:  Demerol, which was brought about — which your lawyers asserted in trial that he was on Demerol.


MURRAY:  Well, he was on Demerol for years and decades.  And if you see the doses that were given, if you look back into the video, as I describe, from Dr. Arnold Klein, he made Michael Jackson a drug addict from Demerol.


LEMON:  What were the changes?  You said because the changes his body was going through.


MURRAY:  It was just like Michael was a hamster, could not sit down, could not rest, was restless.  And he cried and craved sleep.


LEMON:  You said that actually in trial.  Let’s listen to when you said he was like on a hamster wheel.  In the video, you said it, in the video that you have out.  Dr. Conrad Murray talks.  Let’s watch this.




MURRAY:  So in Michael’s case, what he needed that night was not Demerol.  It was not Propofol, excuse me.  He needed to have Demerol.  But since his supply chain was cut from Beverly Hills, he was on his own.


And he had never shared that with me.  So I had no idea why it was so impossible to see Michael like a hamster that night, couldn’t sit down, couldn’t — restless, looked as though he was out of the movie “Thriller.”


And I could not imagine that he was doing something like this.  Had I had any knowledge, his treatment would have been different.  He would have been taken to a hospital for acute withdrawal from opioids, and he would have been treated accordingly.




LEMON:  The video that is posted on your Web site, that you go through all the evidence in the trial and you knock it down.  You refute what you think is wrong about the trial.




LEMON:  You said you didn’t know that about him.  Shouldn’t you have known, though, as his physician?


MURRAY:  If I made any inquiries of Michael as far as drug use and he never give the information up, then how would I get it?


LEMON:  Yes.


MURRAY:  I mean, I would have to depend on my patient to tell me the truth.  And I never got any information from Michael.


LEMON:  My question is, if you say that he was like a hamster up and down, why would you leave him alone for any amount of time?


MURRAY:  It was not that I was leaving Michael alone.  So many times, Michael left me alone.


LEMON:  But on that night, you did?


MURRAY:  Well, no, I never left him during that night.  He left me.


I am — there are two suites, an exclusive bedroom, where I am not allowed.  His children sometimes were invited.  And the suite where I treated Michael, he was clearly able to wander off.  He has a saline bag with a drip on wheels.  There was a Foley catheter that’s attached to him, because he had some incontinence issues.


And — but he would wander off and come back.


LEMON:  So you’re — what you’re asserting is that, on that evening, with all of those drugs, that he left where you were watching him and then went to another part of the bedroom.


But in trial, you said that you left to use the restroom, and you left.  You were on — taking a phone call.


MURRAY:  That wasn’t until the next day.


LEMON:  Your attorney said that.  The next day.


MURRAY:  That was still the next day, after around 11:20 in the morning, 11:20, 11:30.


LEMON:  When did you realize he was in trouble?


MURRAY:  Was what?


LEMON:  When did you realize he was in trouble?


MURRAY:  Michael?


LEMON:  Yes.


MURRAY:  When I came back into the room after I had gone away, called my office, made some calls.


Whatever calls I was making was to make sure that my registration in England was complete, because I had to be his physician over there, and I didn’t want to go practice without having registration.


And it was just about getting that done, the time zone, the differences.  We were taking care of that.  So part of the telephone calls to my office were related to that situation.  I was away from him for — remember, it was 11:25, 11:30.  But that was way beyond any medicine that I give him would have had any effect at all.


LEMON:  So do you take any responsibility in Michael Jackson’s demise, in his death?


MURRAY:  You know, I am very remorseful that Michael has passed away.  Michael was a friend.


And he touched me in so many ways, that I felt like a father figure to Michael, though I wasn’t old enough to be his dad.  I felt as though I was protecting Michael all the time.  I did.


LEMON:  People say they don’t seem — that they don’t think that you have shown any remorse.  Do you — is there — would you like to apologize to anyone?  Would you — what would you like to say?  Because they — why — as a physician, as Michael’s physician, you were responsible for him while you were administering drugs.  You were responsible for the drugs that were brought into his home.  You were his personal physician.


MURRAY:  I think you ask a good question.


First of all, I met Michael Jackson with a stash of Propofol.  And the investigation will also show that there are doctors who could have testified that he came to them with a sports medicine bag filled with Propofol, vials.


The history of the civil trial shows that he had been using Propofol for decades, long before I came on the scene.  I met Michael Jackson in 2006.


LEMON:  But you didn’t have to stay.  You didn’t have to take the job.


MURRAY:  You know, I did not have to take Michael’s job.


And Michael convinced me that I was working so hard saving lives as an acute interventionalist in cardiology, saving lives daily, and working long hours.  He wanted me to take some time off and travel, read some books with him, and just meet a bunch of high-powered kings and queens around the world.


But I give Michael a sense of confidence and protection that he never had.  And he was not about to lose that.


LEMON:  Are you saying you did it out — it wasn’t for the money that you wore making?


MURRAY:  Oh, gosh, no.


LEMON:  It was out of the goodness of your heart?


MURRAY:  Not at all.


LEMON:  Not everybody is going to believe that.




First of all, have I taken care of Michael Jackson for years, out of the goodness of my heart, by giving all of my services for him and his children basically free.


LEMON:  Were you ever paid?


MURRAY:  Michael Jackson refunded me for medicines, but I have never been paid for my services.


LEMON:  All right, stand by, Dr. Murray.  There’s lots more to talk about.


When we come right back, we are going to talk about your trial and whether justice was served.


We are going to take you inside this trial and show you information that you have never seen.




WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR:  Both “The Los Angeles Times” and CBS News are both now reporting that Michael Jackson has died.  CNN has not confirmed that.  But “The L.A. Times” and CBS News are reporting that Michael Jackson, 50 years old, the king of pop, has died.






LEMON:  This is the fifth anniversary of Michael Jackson’s death, and now the man who was convicted of his involuntary manslaughter, Dr. Conrad Murray, is back with me exclusively.  This is his first and only exclusive American interview since he got out of prison.


He has agreed no question is off-limits and he is going to answer everything honestly.


So, I wanted to talk to you.  You talked a little bit about why you took the job and stayed on, even though you knew that Michael had some issues.  Did you identify with him?  What did you see in Michael Jackson that drew you to him and that someone, Michael, who was scared of his own pain, maybe?


MURRAY:  Like a fan, like somebody who got to know Michael Jackson.


Michael Jackson lived a life of pain for so many years, decades, his entire life, his existence.  And after I learned about all of the pains that he had fathomed, I could not help but be sympathetic to this man.  I could not help but to be empathetic.  I could not help but to wear his shoe, and I could not help but to listen to him.


LEMON:  But do you think that cloud — you said as a fan.  Did that cloud your judgment, because, in the end, it seemed that you did him more harm than good, no?


MURRAY:  Never, because I was hired to take — to make sure that Michael Jackson stayed healthy.


But I was also — I agreed with AEG and the — those who were taking care of Michael’s finances that I would show up in about four weeks and wind my practice down gently, easily.  However, they — I was hustled to California because the show was off track.  It was going nowhere.


LEMON:  Because of — was this because of Michael Jackson’s health?


MURRAY:  Because of Michael’s performance.


LEMON:  Performance.


MURRAY:  He was not rehearsing.  He was not doing anything.


LEMON:  Because he couldn’t sleep?


MURRAY:  And AEG has already spent $40 million.


LEMON:  Why wasn’t he rehearsing or doing anything?


MURRAY:  I have no idea.


LEMON:  So they thought it was — had something to do with his health or medically?




MURRAY:  I’m not sure what AEG was thinking.




MURRAY:  But, clearly, they knew something.


LEMON:  Do you think that he was up to these — this 50 — this mammoth 50-show extravaganza that he was to star at the — in London?


MURRAY:  He was not.




MURRAY:  Michael was offered initially 10 shows.  It went to 31 and then subsequently to 50.  But no one knows that he was actually offered 100 shows.




This was something — and, by the way, I covered your trial.  I was there.




LEMON:  I sat right behind the family, right, right behind the mom and the dad.




LEMON:  And I want — this was very — when they played it, very emotional in court.


MURRAY:  Sure.


LEMON:  All right, you recorded Michael talking about the show.  Let’s listen.




JACKSON:  When people leave this show — when people leave my show, I want them to say, I’ve never seen nothing like this in my life.  Go.  Go.  I’ve never seen nothing like this.  Go.  It’s amazing.  He’s the greatest entertainer in the world.




LEMON:  Dr. Murray, that is disturbing.  Anyone in that condition, why would you continue to give him drugs and then give him Propofol?  And why would you record that?


MURRAY:  Well, first of all, I was accused of recording that so that I can take advantage of Michael down the road.  And that was not the case.


I did not even recognize or realize that that recording was actually on my phone.  Michael had asked me, well, as far as I could look back, how much he snores at night.  And I would speak to him about that.  He wanted to record that, not only on tape, but on camera.  I actually had just learned from my daughter who taught me to do talks and one of the apps on the phone.


LEMON:  How to work it.


MURRAY:  Right.


LEMON:  But the question behind that is, so you were trying to monitor his sleep pattern, whether or not he was snoring, and that’s how you got that recording.




MURRAY:  That’s exactly how that was done when I look back in retrospect, yes.


LEMON:  So then why would you continue?  Because if he was…




MURRAY:  Interestingly — good question.


If you look at my — if you listen to that recording, you hear a man that is clearly in the sleep state of going to sleep.  But he is alert.  His conversation makes sense.


LEMON:  His mind is still active, even though he’s in a sleep state.




But if you look at my statement to the police, I explained to them, to the police, all that Michael Jackson wanted, including the children’s hospital.  Michael was just reiterating his dream to me.  At the end of that state, of that recording, did you hear what he says in the end?  He says, I’m asleep.


LEMON:  I’m asleep.


OK.  Let’s move on.  Let’s talk about the drugs, right, more about the drugs.  I want to play this bit from my documentary, and then we will talk about it.


MURRAY:  Sure.




DAVID WALGREN, PROSECUTOR:  Two bottles of Lorazepam.  Lidocaine bottle.


LEMON:  DA Walgren added into evidence each vial and bottle found at Jackson’s house one after another.


WALGREN:  To take a patient with Valium, lorazepam, midazolam, and Propofol and to leave them unattended in that state is medical abandonment.




LEMON:  Did you abandon Michael Jackson, your friend, medically?  Are you guilty of that?


MURRAY:  Absolutely not.  David Walgren He is way off-field.


Abandonment has a clear definition in medicine, and that’s not the case, neither did I abandon him on anything he was giving.  I have said very clearly, if Michael Jackson was in the Propofol infusion, that was a drip for three hours, as Dr. Shafer stated, from 9:00 until 12:00, and I left him with an infusion running, I would be guilty as sin, and I can accept that.


But he was not.


LEMON:  And this bag that was ripped open with the Propofol bottle laying inside of the I.V. bag?


MURRAY:  Interestingly, interestingly…


LEMON:  And you talk than on your video.


MURRAY:  Yes, Propofol comes with a hanging sleeve.  It’s almost like opening a can of soda.  You pop it open.  You hang the bottle.


That bottle was discovered with that device being completely intact.  Why would I take something so simple, take a bag of saline, cut it open, empty the fluid, then stick a Propofol bottle inside of the bag, and then take the bag to become the hanging contraption.


LEMON:  If you knew all of this…




LEMON:  … and I said I was there — and everyone kept saying, is he going to take the stand, is he going to take the stand?  Why didn’t you do it at trial?  I’m — were you thinking all of this at trial?


MURRAY:  Because they had never proven a case.


First of all, they needed to have a drip, a continuous infusion.  That was not the case.  If you look at the numbers…




LEMON:  But my question is, Dr. Murray, why didn’t you take the stand in defense of yourself?


MURRAY:  Because my attorney and I agreed that they had not proven the case against me, so there was no reason to take the stand.  That was the legal advice.


LEMON:  Your attorney was wrong.


MURRAY:  Well, would it have changed anything, Don?


If you look at the DA, the district attorney, Walgren, that altered evidence in the courtroom, tampered with evidence outside of the courtroom also…


LEMON:  Yes.


MURRAY:  … yet, still, jurors are sitting there and watching a prosecutor alter evidence to make his case, to win, and they would still find a man guilty.


LEMON:  Quickly, you go through all of these claims about altering evidence, about coercion and collusion of witnesses and all of that.


MURRAY:  Yes.  Sure.


LEMON:  The appeals court has said they will not rehear your case, that it’s been proven, open-and-shut case.  What are you going to do now?


MURRAY:  Well, the appeals case made a mistake.  They have added tubings.


There was no two tubings, as Dr. Shafer stated in this case.  (INAUDIBLE) There were three tubings.  I have never given Michael Jackson anything with three tubings.




MURRAY:  And my next step, if California does not help me to right this wrong, I’m going to the Supreme Court, the law of the land.  I must believe that our judicial system does have integrity somewhere.


LEMON:  Stay with me, Dr. Murray, because, in some ways, you knew Michael Jackson better than anyone.  You were the last person to see him alive.


When we come right back, we are going to talk about who Michael was behind those closed doors.




UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE:  I have to stop you for a second, A.J.


CNN can now confirm from the — from the L.A. coroner that Michael Jackson is dead.






LEMON:  Michael Jackson was loved by millions of people all around the globe, but no one was a part of his world the way Dr. Conrad Murray was.


And he is back with me now exclusively.


You were the last person to see Michael Jackson alive.


MURRAY:  Correct.


LEMON:  Correct?


MURRAY:  Mm-hmm.


LEMON:  So I want you to take us inside of that room, and I want you to tell us about your relationship with him first.


But I want you to hear from some of your patients, what they said about you.




GARY CAUSEY, PATIENT OF CONRAD MURRAY:  He saved my life, and we have grown close over the last 11 years.


ANDREW GUEST, PATIENT OF CONRAD MURRAY:  We’re all alive today because of Dr. Murray.  He is a great man.


DENNIS HIX, PATIENT OF CONRAD MURRAY:  He is the most compassionate man that I have ever met, best doctor I have ever had.




LEMON:  What is your reaction to that?  Do you miss practicing medicine?


MURRAY:  Of course.  I have never worked a day in my life, because I have enjoyed doing it so much and making the difference in the lives of many.


LEMON:  You realize that you’re vilified around the world, right?  I’m sure you realize that.


MURRAY:  That may be so.


But I’m not a villain.  I can tell you — just let me take you back just briefly.


Dr. Shafer stated that I was reckless, that I used Propofol at home and that should never be done.  All of the doctors who testified in the trial.  Yet all the while I was being vilified by Dr. Shafer, he was protecting Dr. Robert Markman, a doctor who had used Propofol 500 times or more over five years for general anesthesia for his daughter for external gentilia pain.  And I was using Propofol for about sixty days for just (INAUDIBLE).  He defended that doctor as if there was nothing wrong with him.


LEMON: And you talk about that again, in Dr. Conrad Murray –


MURRAY: Absolutely.  All the details are sure.


LEMON: OK, so let’s talk about Michael since we have you here. I want to hear about this person you call your friend.  You say you knew him better than anyone towards the end of his life — than anyone, correct?




LEMON: Did he share secrets with you?


MURRAY: Of course.  The most hidden treasure trove of his life is with me.  But have I protected Michael up until now.


LEMON: Up until now?


MURRAY: Of course.  Of course.  I’ve said nothing that has been inflammatory about my friend.  I protected Michael.  You see, when I had — the officials, and they pointed to Michael, the guy who could not pay me for months after taking care of him, and it’s sad that he could not pay for the Popsicle his daughters were using, the toilet paper that they were using to wipe their private areas, that he was penniless, I was shocked.  It was that time when Michael came to me trembling and trying to get me away from the A.G. official who was Randy Phillips.


I was shocked.  I should have just picked my bottles up and leave had I been looking for money.  But there wasn’t money.  It was about the love of Michael.


I have suffered a lot.  There is no doubt about it.  But I don’t hate Michael.  Michael did not do me wrong.  He did not want this to happen to me.  Whatever happened to Michael when I was not there is probably his own misjudgment.  And I believe that that clearly happened because he was illogical, he was irrational, and he was in the withdrawal state from Demerol that Dr. (INAUDIBLE) Klein was feeding him.


LEMON: You said that he gave himself the drugs. You believe he gave himself the final dose?


MURRAY: The premises cannot be breached. It was not breached. There was no one else in the house, in the upper chambers but Michael and myself.  I was away from him.  The phone records shows that.


LEMON: But again I ask, should you have been with him?


MURRAY: No.  That’s a good question.  Because I gave Michael Jackson 25 milligrams of Propofol over three to five minutes.  All of the doctors, seven doctors in the test trial, assured there could be no Propofol effects after 10, maximum 15 minutes by Dr. Rogers, which is what I told police.  If I give Michael Jackson between 10:40 and 10:50, 25 milligrams of Propofol, the effect of the drug would be gone by 11:00.




MURRAY: If I monitor him, (INAUDIBLE) by 11:20 —


LEMON: You believe, according to medical standards, that you were reasonable with that.


MURRAY: Absolutely.


LEMON: So you said you haven’t shared any secrets of Michael’s until now.  Do you plan to?  Is there something you want to tell us?


MURRAY: I would not share with you any hidden secrets of Michael.  Not at this time.  We don’t have that in summary.


LEMON: But how long you going to be silent?


MURRAY: How long am I going to be silent?  As long as I wish to.  I really —


LEMON: One day will you tell?


MURRAY: I can’t answer the question, to be totally honest.  And I don’t know.  I still protect Michael.


LEMON: What is your life like now?  Everywhere you go, today you went somewhere, and I saw a picture of you, and they had a picture of you drinking, getting milk, and they said oh, that’s what Michael Jackson called Propofol, milk.  And that must be some sort of, you know, there is a message that you’re sending.


MURRAY: Tabloids will twist anything. You know, milk.  They have called Michael all kinds of names.  I have  not.  My life is certainly a struggle.  I’m doing the best I can to put it back on track —


LEMON: You get depressed?


MURRAY: Me?  No.


LEMON: How do you take care of yourself?


MURRAY: Family and friends, the goodness of my family and friends.


LEMON: The kindness of family and friends.


MURRAY: Kindness, yes. Exactly.


LEMON: So you have no job. I know you’re working for the Trinidad Medical —


MURRAY: I am not working for Trinidad medical government.  I have volunteered to bring cardiac surgery for the pediatric children more available.  I have helped with their program, which took about seven weeks.


LEMON: So you have no income?




LEMON: None at all?




LEMON: So I have to ask you this.  Michael Jackson’s children.




LEMON: Some of them are doing okay.  Some of them are suffering horribly.  His girl tried to commit suicide according to reports.  What do you say?  They were there that night or that afternoon watching their father, — if not dying, already dead.




LEMON: What do you say to them?


MURRAY: Oh, my gosh.  The loss is monumental.  I grieve for Michael every day.  And I grieve for those children.  I was the only person that Michael brought to his attention of all his families and friends who were still hugging his children.  They would come into my arms every day.  That warms his heart.  His father had never done that. His mother and sisters were never embracing the children.


I was at the hospital the day that Michael passed away.  And they did not put an arm around the children.  The only time I saw an arm around Paris is when she cried on stage, and I saw her aunt place her (INAUDIBLE) hands over her mouth (ph).  Was she trying to shut her up or was she really trying to comfort her?  I don’t know.


But I love those children.  And you know what?  Maybe there will be a day when they would like to speak with me.  And I am quite open.  I have nothing to hide.


LEMON: Do you have anything to say to his family, to his mother?


MURRAY: Michael loved his mother of the only other relatives that he had.  Prior to Michael’s death, he announced to me he had four family members besides himself — Paris, Michael, and Prince Michael, Blanket and Dr.  Conrad.  That was his family.  Everyone else was totally absolved from his life.


He used his mother only because she may be the only chance of maybe having some way to pacify things between the differences in the family.  But not — but he did not have a relationship with any members.


LEMON: And yet you’re the only one people hold responsible for his death, and you went to prison.


MURRAY: You know, I have been hurt.  There is no doubt about it.  But I carry no anger.  I would not allow them to do that to me.  I would like to hopefully one day use my testimony so that it can prevent others who have undergone injustice; innocent men go to prison all the time.  Maybe they should wear one of the shoes.


Now let me say something about the fans, for example.  There are all kinds of fans.  There are those who are diehards and have their reasons, and there are many who have.  I am Michael’s fan.


LEMON: Right.


MURRAY: But regardless —


LEMON: Okay. Do you think you deserve a second chance?  Anew beginning?  You would like to practice medicine again.


MURRAY: Absolutely.


LEMON: Sometime second chances, though, are new beginnings.  You can’t go back and do what you did before.  Maybe you’ll have to do something else.


MURRAY: I will serve humanity.


LEMON: Thank you, Dr. Conrad Murray.  Appreciate you.  Best of luck.


MURRAY: You’re welcome.